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Thread: yahoos

  1. #1
    SQA Council
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    yahoos

    User jonathanlcampbell (jon.campbell@crbard.com.nospam) posted:

    Hello, folks,

    I'm new to this forum but not new to QA and development.

    I'm a little surprised to find that there are people who are
    asking how to buy cheap copies of WinRunner or download them for
    free. Most experienced QA engineers know that good test packages vary
    from very expensive to outrageously expensive, and are available only
    from the companies that manufacture them; they are not "consumer
    items."

    I'm certain the seasoned users of this forum find this kind of
    nonsense frustrating, embarrassing, or downright stupid. It leads
    to "novice profiling" (similar to the Nubee profiling that goes on in
    Unix discussions) and it is not healthy.

    Maybe given the nature of the market - that there are a lot of
    beginning QA engineers who have lost their jobs and are desperate to
    enhance their resumes - we should send an extra introductory message
    to new users of the forum outlining what is obvious to the rest of us:

    1. WinRunner is one of the most (if not the most) sophisticated and
    complex and expensive GUI test tools available, and the only people
    who actually BUY it are companies who can make that investment or
    Mercury test tool professional consultants who have been doing this
    work for a long time.

    2. No, you can't buy WinRunner at Best Buy, and you can't download
    a "free copy" anywhere. If Mercury Interactive found someone giving
    it away on the net, they would rightfully and legally shut it down.
    You can get a certain amount of documentation for the product for
    free, because Mercury Interactive wants to encourage people to learn
    to use the product to its fullest. But to actually get your hands on
    the software requires working for a company that has purchased it or
    to go to a course offered by Mercury Interactive (and then you only
    get to use it during the course - you don't get to take it home...).

    For those novice users who are listening: read and memorize the
    WinRunner documentation that is available on the Mercury Interactive
    Website and elsewhere. Then pay the money to take a WinRunner course
    in which you use the package intensively for a week. Then you can, in
    good conscience, put the knowledge you've gained on your resume in
    the "Education" section, but it's best to just leave it for
    discussion at the interview. Don't try to use a course or peripheral
    knowledge to get your foot into door for an interview.

    Thanks and regards
    Jon Campbell
    Campbell Quality Systems
    QA Consultant



  2. #2
    SQA Council
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    Re: yahoos

    User Stephanie (ssylve1445@mindspring.com.nospam) posted:

    ------=_NextPart_000_0191_01C1BEAD.14A805A0
    Content-Type: text/plain;
    charset="iso-8859-1"
    Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    well put. I would also add that helping some try to pass themselves off as =
    knowing WinRunner hurts all those who actually know how to use the product.=
    I went to a client who had hired a person that claimed to know WinRunner a=
    nd the first thing he asked was "how do you know if WinRunner is loaded on =
    the machine". This client then put me through all kinds of unnecessary chec=
    king and looking over my shoulder that caused delays in my timeline. When I=
    first started using the product, I was honest with my employer and said I =
    do not know how to use WinRunner then went on to talk about my ability to l=
    earn software quickly, and my other skills that was just as important as kn=
    owing how to use WinRunner. By being truthful about my skills, I was given =
    the opportunity to learn WinRunner and become proficient enough in WinRunne=
    r that people ask me questions off-line, my clients are always happy with m=
    y work and I am asked to present papers at QA conferences.

    Stephanie=20
    Initiatives
    ----- Original Message -----=20
    From: jonathanlcampbell=20
    To: winrunner@yahoogroups.com=20
    Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 9:25 AM
    Subject: [winrunner] yahoos


    Hello, folks,

    I'm new to this forum but not new to QA and development.

    I'm a little surprised to find that there are people who are=20
    asking how to buy cheap copies of WinRunner or download them for=20
    free. Most experienced QA engineers know that good test packages vary=20
    from very expensive to outrageously expensive, and are available only=20
    from the companies that manufacture them; they are not "consumer=20
    items."

    I'm certain the seasoned users of this forum find this kind of=20
    nonsense frustrating, embarrassing, or downright stupid. It leads=20
    to "novice profiling" (similar to the Nubee profiling that goes on in=20
    Unix discussions) and it is not healthy.

    Maybe given the nature of the market - that there are a lot of=20
    beginning QA engineers who have lost their jobs and are desperate to=20
    enhance their resumes - we should send an extra introductory message=20
    to new users of the forum outlining what is obvious to the rest of us:

    1. WinRunner is one of the most (if not the most) sophisticated and=20
    complex and expensive GUI test tools available, and the only people=20
    who actually BUY it are companies who can make that investment or=20
    Mercury test tool professional consultants who have been doing this=20
    work for a long time.

    2. No, you can't buy WinRunner at Best Buy, and you can't download=20
    a "free copy" anywhere. If Mercury Interactive found someone giving=20
    it away on the net, they would rightfully and legally shut it down.=20
    You can get a certain amount of documentation for the product for=20
    free, because Mercury Interactive wants to encourage people to learn=20
    to use the product to its fullest. But to actually get your hands on=20
    the software requires working for a company that has purchased it or=20
    to go to a course offered by Mercury Interactive (and then you only=20
    get to use it during the course - you don't get to take it home...).

    For those novice users who are listening: read and memorize the=20
    WinRunner documentation that is available on the Mercury Interactive=20
    Website and elsewhere. Then pay the money to take a WinRunner course=20
    in which you use the package intensively for a week. Then you can, in=20
    good conscience, put the knowledge you've gained on your resume in=20
    the "Education" section, but it's best to just leave it for=20
    discussion at the interview. Don't try to use a course or peripheral=20
    knowledge to get your foot into door for an interview.

    Thanks and regards
    Jon Campbell
    Campbell Quality Systems
    QA Consultant


    Yahoo! Groups Sponsor=20
    ADVERTISEMENT
    =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20
    =20=20=20=20=20=20=20
    =20=20=20=20=20=20=20


  3. #3
    SQA Council
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    Re: yahoos

    User Mike Street (a_b_c_d27889@hotmail.com.nospam) posted:


    <div style='background-color:'><DIV>

    < !-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->


  4. #4
    Senior Member
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    Seattle, Wa
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    Re: yahoos

    User Steve Mathisen (scmathisen@hotmail.com.nospam) posted:

    Well said...

    Steve Mathisen


    From: "jonathanlcampbell" <jon.campbell@crbard.com>
    Reply-To: winrunner@yahoogroups.com
    To: winrunner@yahoogroups.com
    Subject: [winrunner] yahoos
    Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 14:25:31 -0000

    Hello, folks,

    I'm new to this forum but not new to QA and development.

    I'm a little surprised to find that there are people who are
    asking how to buy cheap copies of WinRunner or download them for
    free. Most experienced QA engineers know that good test packages vary
    from very expensive to outrageously expensive, and are available only
    from the companies that manufacture them; they are not "consumer
    items."

    I'm certain the seasoned users of this forum find this kind of
    nonsense frustrating, embarrassing, or downright stupid. It leads
    to "novice profiling" (similar to the Nubee profiling that goes on in
    Unix discussions) and it is not healthy.

    Maybe given the nature of the market - that there are a lot of
    beginning QA engineers who have lost their jobs and are desperate to
    enhance their resumes - we should send an extra introductory message
    to new users of the forum outlining what is obvious to the rest of us:

    1. WinRunner is one of the most (if not the most) sophisticated and
    complex and expensive GUI test tools available, and the only people
    who actually BUY it are companies who can make that investment or
    Mercury test tool professional consultants who have been doing this
    work for a long time.

    2. No, you can't buy WinRunner at Best Buy, and you can't download
    a "free copy" anywhere. If Mercury Interactive found someone giving
    it away on the net, they would rightfully and legally shut it down.
    You can get a certain amount of documentation for the product for
    free, because Mercury Interactive wants to encourage people to learn
    to use the product to its fullest. But to actually get your hands on
    the software requires working for a company that has purchased it or
    to go to a course offered by Mercury Interactive (and then you only
    get to use it during the course - you don't get to take it home...).

    For those novice users who are listening: read and memorize the
    WinRunner documentation that is available on the Mercury Interactive
    Website and elsewhere. Then pay the money to take a WinRunner course
    in which you use the package intensively for a week. Then you can, in
    good conscience, put the knowledge you've gained on your resume in
    the "Education" section, but it's best to just leave it for
    discussion at the interview. Don't try to use a course or peripheral
    knowledge to get your foot into door for an interview.

    Thanks and regards
    Jon Campbell
    Campbell Quality Systems
    QA Consultant
    Steve Mathisen
    &lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Quality is the result of a carefully constructed cultural environment. It has to be the fabric of the organization, not part of the fabric.
    Philip Crosby

  5. #5
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    Re: yahoos

    Here-here! (or is it hear-hear?)

    I actually cannot blame people for wanting to learn these items and try to find out if there are eval copies. Unless one knows the value of the tool, they wouldn't necessarily know how expensive it is.

    Think of any product and the levels of quality or value in them. Take steak.
    Round steak vs. filet mignon. If you know nothing about steak and you see the price of $1.39 lb vs. 10.59 lb. what are you going to pick? Steak is steak, right? (not!)

    New QA people and novices will probably continue to ask the questions about free software. I'm going to keep a link to your note and refer them here. You've put it very well.

    ------------------
    -- Jean
    There are no failures.
    There are only extended learning opportunities.
    Jean James
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    I deliver what I promise, and I only promise what I can deliver.
    ------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

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