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Thread: Team Work

  1. #1
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    Team Work

    Is there any benefits for separating Testing a Development? Our Testing department has been informed that we are no longer to have open communication with development.

  2. #2
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    Re: Team Work

    Ooo... bad juju here. In what way will you not have open communication with Development? You are not allowed to talk to individuals directly, you are not to email them, you are not to contact the group with out management approval?

    Give us some idea of how they have 'cut you off' and we will be more than willing to help you 'fix' this problem.

    Bottom line; by not communicating with Development you will increase your risk and chances for failure on the project(s). Open communication between groups is a key to project success (all around) and is the one thing Testing will need in order to do its job effectively. This will lead to economic repercussions (wasted time chasing information down and miscommunications causing rework).

    Now seperating the two groups can be a good thing as you will gain some level of autonomy and will get you out from under the developers thumb. But when this happens communication becomes even more important.

    Whoever's bonehead idea this was needs to have a serious attitude adjustment made. [img]images/icons/cool.gif[/img]

    Jim
    Jim
    -------------------------------------------
    For all the general stuff to know about QA/Test go here http://www.softwareqatest.com/

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    Re: Team Work

    The communication between Management and Inteligence is also forbiden????
    Don't worry, be Happy!

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    Re: Team Work

    The most ineffective workers are systematically moved to the place where they can do the least damage: Management.


    -
    Personal Comment

    Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.
    ~ Winston Churchill ~


    ...Rich Wagner

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    Re: Team Work

    Originally posted by tbbsk9:
    Our Testing department has been informed that we are no longer to have open communication with development.
    <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">Have you been given any reason for this change?
    Joe Strazzere
    Visit my website: AllThingsQuality.com to learn more about quality, testing, and QA!

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    Re: Team Work

    I purposefully left out details to get a first impression on the topic.

    We are on a 2 month release cycle.
    Requirements are not well documented.
    Testing has been faulted for development being behind schedule with the releases.
    Testing is not allowed in the development department. Only communication is via email and with permission from the Testing and Development management.

    These are the following step to have any dialogue with a developer.
    1) E-mail the Testing Team lead and Testing manager
    2) If you get permission from the Testing manager then you email the Development management with question/issue.
    3) If you get permission from the Development manager then you email the developer.

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    Re: Team Work

    When we were confronted with this issue several years ago we set up a Q & A board as part of the Defect Manager software and all developers were requested to view and answer questions when they had time. It took a while but it finally caught on.
    Personal Comment

    Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.
    ~ Winston Churchill ~


    ...Rich Wagner

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    Re: Team Work

    There shouldn't need to be any strict rules limiting communication. If you've come to that, there are other problems that you'd be better off fixing. *However*, if a tester goes to a developer with a problem, this takes up time that management might decide would be better to put off until later. We've had most success with just submitting incidents/features and waiting for them to be assigned. Sometimes we go ask brief questions, but its understood that the developers are only supposed to work on their assigned tasks. One thing that I believe should not be done is for developers to pass off some test code to testing that is outside of the build process (maybe exceptions in rare cases). My rule of thumb would be to never bother the development team unless you needed an answer to something that was delaying your testing or might be high-risk and can't wait til management reviewed it. Possibly your issue is that management team isn't effectively communicating and you're forced to work directly with the developers.

  9. #9
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    Re: Team Work

    Sounds to me as if they have put those rules into place for a reason. My guess would be that development staff have complained that too much of their time is spent answering questions, and that those questions are "stupid". Having to document these questions will allow both Testing Management and Development Management to ascertain where the specs are failing to provide enough info, whether your questions are valid, and how many you have, in order to make further changes to improve the situation. It is sometimes difficult to make anyone improve what they do without documented proof and statistics; the process your company has set up will allow management to do that.

    Sounds like there are serious tensions between the two groups; give it a little time to cool down and things may either change back or change for the better.

    I worked at a company that instituted the same thing (and it had to do with development complaints); it actually turned out worse for the dev. staff, because not only was every question put through as valid, the managers followed up to make sure the QA staff got answers to their questions, and the QA staff had documented proof of what they asked, when, and to whom. In addition, people who were "scratching at each other" were pulled up short by their management if their EMails were impolite or unprofessional. Once the issues were identified and improved, things went back to a more normal process. If nothing else, management staff get tired of weeding through stacks of questions! The process also might have been put into place because verbal communications were inappropriate or hostile, and while management could not be present at every conversation between the two areas, they felt they might be able to head trouble off at the pass by reviewing EMails in advance.

    Does it sound like any of these things could be the underlying reason for the changes?

    My sympathies; it's a cumbersome pain in the butt to be restricted that way...

    - Linda

  10. #10
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    Re: Team Work

    Testing has been faulted for development being behind schedule with the releases.
    <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">


    How? What impact does testing have on Development? Because you keeping finding stuff in the code? Because the requirements keeping changing? Because code is not delivered on time? Because you cannot execute your tests in an insanely short amount of time?

    As Bryan had mentioned, and I agree, there is a more deep seated problem that needs to be identified (admitted to) and resolved.

    For now go through the motions on this one. A pain in the rear end, but if testing is blamed again then you have documentation of things and can also say that you followed process and that something else fundamental has to be fixed. A good thing to do is come up with alternative solutions (show how they help with the time and money aspects of the projects) after the $#!^ has hit the fan. Do so in a positive way as to not to aggrevate more the relationship of the two groups.

    To me this sounds like Development deflecting and pointing a finger at Test (allowing $#!^ to flow downhill). I have been there and done that one before. Best thing to do in this situation is to keep good records, stay positive and be part of the solution and not the problem. You will have to bite your tongue (smile alot), but by keeping cool you will show management that the Test group is trying to help and not hinder.

    Good luck.

    Jim
    Jim
    -------------------------------------------
    For all the general stuff to know about QA/Test go here http://www.softwareqatest.com/

 

 
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